To sand or not to sand.....
Quote from Mark Curran on November 3, 2023, 4:47 pmMary et al:
I'm curious what the prevailing feeling is with regard to sanding a project as a "final" step. I suspect the answer is that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but is sanding to achieve a smoother finish (e.g., remove pesky tool marks, deal with difficult grain transitions, etc) enough to get me kicked out of the carvers' guild (if I ever get into it)? I'm particularly interested in this when working on a project where I'm trying to achieve the most natural/realistic appearance possible (e.g., I've recently carved the convex scallop shell, IMO it came out pretty good, but I think a light sanding would make it even better). I'll appreciate whatever thoughts you care to share; thanks!
Mary et al:
I'm curious what the prevailing feeling is with regard to sanding a project as a "final" step. I suspect the answer is that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but is sanding to achieve a smoother finish (e.g., remove pesky tool marks, deal with difficult grain transitions, etc) enough to get me kicked out of the carvers' guild (if I ever get into it)? I'm particularly interested in this when working on a project where I'm trying to achieve the most natural/realistic appearance possible (e.g., I've recently carved the convex scallop shell, IMO it came out pretty good, but I think a light sanding would make it even better). I'll appreciate whatever thoughts you care to share; thanks!
Quote from Ed Frank on November 6, 2023, 5:54 pmI'm a new carver, definitely not in the guild, so no worries about getting chucked out! I am carving furniture ornamentation in walnut right now. For the gooseneck, I sanded to smooth out the profile and used scrapers. I'm carving flutes in some quarter columns that are about 1" in diameter and a foot long, yet have 8 flutes about 1/4" wide (#9/5mm) separated by 1/8" flats. I'm using sandpaper to true up the flats because I just don't have the skill to make that fine, 1/8" wide 12-inch long flat look good enough. The eye picks up all the little wiggles. On the other hand, I did not sand the rosettes that I carved because that would destroy the crisp details. I'm still learning to carve flame finials, but there too I won't sand. There is an applied ornament comprising scrolls, etc., that go on the tympanum of the clock that I'm making. I do not plan to do any sanding there, again because it would wash it out. My word means little, but that's what I've done. I'm posting partly to confess and also because I, too, am curious how much sanding would be done by better carvers in the instances when I've used it.
I'm a new carver, definitely not in the guild, so no worries about getting chucked out! I am carving furniture ornamentation in walnut right now. For the gooseneck, I sanded to smooth out the profile and used scrapers. I'm carving flutes in some quarter columns that are about 1" in diameter and a foot long, yet have 8 flutes about 1/4" wide (#9/5mm) separated by 1/8" flats. I'm using sandpaper to true up the flats because I just don't have the skill to make that fine, 1/8" wide 12-inch long flat look good enough. The eye picks up all the little wiggles. On the other hand, I did not sand the rosettes that I carved because that would destroy the crisp details. I'm still learning to carve flame finials, but there too I won't sand. There is an applied ornament comprising scrolls, etc., that go on the tympanum of the clock that I'm making. I do not plan to do any sanding there, again because it would wash it out. My word means little, but that's what I've done. I'm posting partly to confess and also because I, too, am curious how much sanding would be done by better carvers in the instances when I've used it.
Quote from Mark Curran on November 7, 2023, 8:06 pmThanks for the feedback, Ed. I also consider myself to be a new carver, so looking forward to hearing from others across the range of experience.
Thanks for the feedback, Ed. I also consider myself to be a new carver, so looking forward to hearing from others across the range of experience.
Quote from MaryMay on December 8, 2023, 10:49 amHi Mark,
Ah... the age old sanding question. I am (sort of) a purist when it comes to sanding completed carvings. The one thing I recommend is to not rely on sanding. Try and achieve the final, smooth surface right from the gouges. It saves time, and doesn't create the nasty dust that sanding does. Then if sanding is necessary, it should only be light sanding to remove any tool marks. In other word, don't use the "50 grit gouge" and actually try to shape wood with sandpaper.
The times that I do sand are when it is critical to have a very smooth surface. The Newports shells - I sand the final surface with 380 grit, but be very careful not to soften the sharp corners. I only sand the rounded and hollowed surfaces, and the inside, sharp corners. The high edges are what you want to avoid.
I also tend to sand where the obvious transition between the carved part and the flat, planed surface of the wood makes an obvious "edge" (for example very shallow relief carvings where only the outer edges are rounded). But again, only very fine sanding, and nothing that leaves scratch marks.
The challenge with sanding a carving is that there is no way to only stay sanding "with the grain". There are areas where you simply have to sand across the grain. Therefore, the surface of the wood tends to get roughed up in general. This isn't always a problem, but just something to be aware of.
Woods that I would consider sanding more than others - basswood, butternut, mahogany
Woods that I would try not to sand (because of the sheen that comes straight from gouges) - walnut & cherry
And no, you won't be kicked out of any club. I just hide my sandpaper in my workshop.
Oh, and one other thing - never sand with regular "grit" sandpaper until you are completely finished with your carving. Grit will be left in the wood and really dull your chisels. I have discovered "sandless" sandpaper - Mirka Abranet, and well... I have been sanding my carvings a bit more since discovering that.
Hope this helps!
Hi Mark,
Ah... the age old sanding question. I am (sort of) a purist when it comes to sanding completed carvings. The one thing I recommend is to not rely on sanding. Try and achieve the final, smooth surface right from the gouges. It saves time, and doesn't create the nasty dust that sanding does. Then if sanding is necessary, it should only be light sanding to remove any tool marks. In other word, don't use the "50 grit gouge" and actually try to shape wood with sandpaper.
The times that I do sand are when it is critical to have a very smooth surface. The Newports shells - I sand the final surface with 380 grit, but be very careful not to soften the sharp corners. I only sand the rounded and hollowed surfaces, and the inside, sharp corners. The high edges are what you want to avoid.
I also tend to sand where the obvious transition between the carved part and the flat, planed surface of the wood makes an obvious "edge" (for example very shallow relief carvings where only the outer edges are rounded). But again, only very fine sanding, and nothing that leaves scratch marks.
The challenge with sanding a carving is that there is no way to only stay sanding "with the grain". There are areas where you simply have to sand across the grain. Therefore, the surface of the wood tends to get roughed up in general. This isn't always a problem, but just something to be aware of.
Woods that I would consider sanding more than others - basswood, butternut, mahogany
Woods that I would try not to sand (because of the sheen that comes straight from gouges) - walnut & cherry
And no, you won't be kicked out of any club. I just hide my sandpaper in my workshop.
Oh, and one other thing - never sand with regular "grit" sandpaper until you are completely finished with your carving. Grit will be left in the wood and really dull your chisels. I have discovered "sandless" sandpaper - Mirka Abranet, and well... I have been sanding my carvings a bit more since discovering that.
Hope this helps!
Quote from Mark Curran on December 9, 2023, 8:57 amThanks for all the great feedback, Mary; much appreciated. I understand your guidance on when/when not to sand (i.e., strive to make the carving speak for itself as much as possible; sand only where it makes sense, and don't treat sand paper as if it is another gouge; etc.). I hadn't been aware of sandless sandpaper, so I'll also check that out for rare but appropriate use. I'm currently working on the small sun burst lesson (fireplace surround) and noted that you made use of a riffler file for some of the sharp edges; I may give that a try.
P.S. My wife and I recently spent a few days in Charleston and Savannah and it didn't dawn on me until afterward (of course) to see if stopping by your studio for a tour might be possible. My bad!
Happy Holidays to you and your family, and thanks again!
Thanks for all the great feedback, Mary; much appreciated. I understand your guidance on when/when not to sand (i.e., strive to make the carving speak for itself as much as possible; sand only where it makes sense, and don't treat sand paper as if it is another gouge; etc.). I hadn't been aware of sandless sandpaper, so I'll also check that out for rare but appropriate use. I'm currently working on the small sun burst lesson (fireplace surround) and noted that you made use of a riffler file for some of the sharp edges; I may give that a try.
P.S. My wife and I recently spent a few days in Charleston and Savannah and it didn't dawn on me until afterward (of course) to see if stopping by your studio for a tour might be possible. My bad!
Happy Holidays to you and your family, and thanks again!